Community Poll #3 - User interface windows

DarkWasp

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It's time for our third Community Poll, but first lets recap the previous two.

In Community Poll #1 we discussed various ideas for the leveling and item system in the mod. In general, we decided to do these systems much differently than the way they were done in MS:C.

In Community Poll #2 we voted on the way the inventory would work. So far most people would rather have multiple storage units (bags, quivers and holsters) instead of just one unlimited backpack.

Both polls are still open and you may still post your ideas.
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Now, for our third poll we will discuss how we would like to control the UI. Like the second poll we have two options, but we also encourage you to post your own ideas if you think you have come up with something better.

System #1: The interface is split up into different windows.

This option is the most like MS:C, pressing "I" opened the inventory and "P" opened to character panel. In other games we've seen systems like this used where "L" opens the quest log, "M" opens the map, "K" opens skills and abilities .etc
Each window is separate and has its own exclusive function.

System #2:
The whole interface opens on one window and has tabs.

Oblivion is likely the most popular example of this. "Tab" is the universal button. It is responsible for your quest log, spells, inventory, attributes, conditions and more.
It works as kind of a one stop location for all your UI needs. Functions may have exclusive tabs, but do not have their own window.

Keep in mind the controls mentioned are only examples. Controls in MS:S will be customizable.

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I'll kick this off like I did in Community Poll #2, by listing the pros and cons. Only this time without illustrations (I know I know, so sad) and much shorter in length.

Here's the trade off:

System 1:
Good: No need to click through tabs. You want the character panel? Press the right button and you have it.
- Multiple windows tend to feel more flexible than just one window with tabs.
Bad: Increases the number of buttons required to control the game.
- Possible cases of clutter when working with multiple UI windows at once.

System 2:
Good: You only need one button. After you press it, everything you need is just one mouse click (or maybe even hotkey) away.
- Very organized.
Bad: Lack of exclusivity. "I just wanted the skill panel, nothing else."
- May not open the tab you wanted first. / Does not encourage remembering hotkeys as much as System 1.


Let us know what you think.
 

Tigerkev

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System #2 but with a option to have the tab you want to open first ;)
 

Thothie

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Nothing stopping you from combining all the good of #1 in #2. Just make hot keys that go straight to certain tabs.
 

zeus9860

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Tigerkev said:
System #2 but with a option to have the tab you want to open first ;)

^This

or

vThis

Thothie said:
Nothing stopping you from combining all the good of #1 in #2. Just make hot keys that go straight to certain tabs.


Either way works, since both options require just one key or more(if we want to bind more).
 

Caluminium

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Thothie said:
Nothing stopping you from combining all the good of #1 in #2. Just make hot keys that go straight to certain tabs.
 

Orochi

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Indeed, and I had planned to add optional arguments to the console command to allow you to bind keys to open to a specific tab, so I don't see why we can't combine them. ;)

More to the point though; what DarkWasp is getting at here is do you want the windows separate with multiple keys for each like in MS:C, or an Oblivion-style interface where it's all part of the same window, and has tabs to switch between them. Note that if we choose the tabbed option, it does not mean that we cannot offer the ability to open to a specific tab. Please keep this in mind when deciding.
 

Caluminium

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I'd like one with tabs which can be binded.
 

jon50559

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I hate the universal tab type of interface, it reeks of simplified console controls. I prefer seeing a nice, clean window which is specialized just for the key I pressed, whether it be general character info, inventory, etc. Remembering a few more keybinds is nothing for most people, they become second nature after some time anyway.
 

Monika's_BFFEx0255

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Oh I cant decide without the fancy pictures...
I like #1 because
jon50559 said:
I hate the universal tab type of interface, it reeks of simplified console controls. I prefer seeing a nice, clean window which is specialized just for the key I pressed, whether it be general character info, inventory, etc. Remembering a few more keybinds is nothing for most people, they become second nature after some time anyway.
 

Deantwo

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System #2:
as far as i remember... in Oblivion the game pauses when you open the "window"... that's the only real reason i'd say it's good... cause you can take your time looking for the tab you want...
but since this is a multiplayer game... i don't think we would be able to pause the game everything someone need to look at something...

System #1:
like most RPG games you can open just the window you want with... and you don't have to start looking for the right tab... this means there's less time looking for what you need...
in other words... if you say need to open your backpack while in a heated battle... you just want one button to the thing you need...

Conclusion:
but combining the two systems a little can't hurt... like skills and character sheet... and so...
but you could rather then that look at... when and why would you need to open what window? is this something the play will need in the middle of a fight?
if not then there's no harm in making it a tab on say the character sheet...
but if it is... you want the right window right away... no tab... no seaching...

in MS:C you have to open the inventory a lot... even in combat... mostly cause some things you can't hotkey (like scrolls and potions)

there... i think that's my view on it ^^;
 

Age

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I don't care if it reeks of simplified console controls. Oblivion was a damn good game and pressing tab for my universal menu on PC didn't kill me at all. Hotkeys to whichever tab you want at the time only makes it better.
 

DarkWasp

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My own personal vote goes toward System 1.

Oblivion is one of my favorite games of all time, but I like having different windows. Even with hotkeys for tabs, I prefer not to have all of my windows pop up in the same place.


HOWEVER, an Open All Bags button would be very very nice.
 

jon50559

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Age said:
I don't care if it reeks of simplified console controls. Oblivion was a damn good game and pressing tab for my universal menu on PC didn't kill me at all. Hotkeys to whichever tab you want at the time only makes it better.

Oblivion was also a singleplayer only, all the time game. In a multiplayer environment, having a bulky screen pop up that handles any task you might want to do not only slows down the process of achieving the task, it also creates unnecessary clutter for the player to visually sort through. Individual screens with different hotkeys is much better suited for a faster-paced environment.
 

Orochi

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All of you guys still aren't realizing that we can combine the two, so to speak. I can create the console command to open the window such that you can bind different keys to open to different tabs.
 

Red Cell

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I'll take whichever one has the greatest ease of use (both in terms of the amount of buttons pushed/things clicked and the amount of time needed to get what I want from the system). That is typically the more simplified one. Whichever that one can be.
 

DarkWasp

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Orochi said:
All of you guys still aren't realizing that we can combine the two, so to speak. I can create the console command to open the window such that you can bind different keys to open to different tabs.

I realize this, I just prefer my windows having separate shapes, taking up separate potions of the window and/or being movable.

It's only a slight preference.
 

Age

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I'd be surprised to see moveable/sizable windows in a Source game, but then again, I don't play many Source mods anymore, so it may be awkwardly possible. With my understood limits of the Source engine, I want a combination of both, not the either/or. Make it toggleable or something if you have to, for the freaks that want to make this game harder for me to play with one hand whilst half-asleep.
 

jon50559

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I realize you can combine the two, but it still means that the same looking bulky menu would pop up whether or not you pressed a hotkey or the general button. I dislike bulky menus.
 

Deantwo

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Orochi said:
All of you guys still aren't realizing that we can combine the two, so to speak. I can create the console command to open the window such that you can bind different keys to open to different tabs.
well... i wouldn't mine that at all... i haven't played Oblivion for some time... but i did like the system... just saying that... it would be a little hard to use on the fly... while in combat...
so yeah... some good hotkeys to go to just the tab you need would be nice...

just i remember Oblivion's "window" to be a little... well... one huge block of buttons ^^; and it was in the middle of the screen...
at least make us able to really see what we are doing on the screen behind the "window"... i like the way it is in MS:C... cause i can still see what i am doing...

unless you want to go super realistic and force people with big backpacks to stop up and looking down into it... would be cool... and make smaller backs more use fun i guess... but maybe a bit hard to make... just so many games have Hammer-Space ^^;
 

Thothie

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>_>

But it is true - since we can - what possible advantage could there be to the first model then?
 

cartman-2000

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Thothie said:
Nothing stopping you from combining all the good of #1 in #2. Just make hot keys that go straight to certain tabs.
This is how it's done in dead space 1&2. Tabbed window with keys to go to certain tabs.
 

zeus9860

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Just do like borderlands, multiple key binds to open a certain tab that takes part of 1 single window, and it's not that messy at all.

Or

If this one is possible to do, make a system where you get the option to put all tabs separated (default) and then you can put them in a single window by moving them on top of each other. This is like doing both systems, probably too much but at least it would work for both sides >_>
 

Thothie

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Eh, whatevah... Just be sure to leave some space in your tab list so you can add stuff later without too much trouble.
 
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