EXP

[TheOysterHippopotami]

It might be cool if the rate of exp gain gradually increased as you killed/damaged enemies, provided you don't die. I think if a person can solo a map without dying he deserves more exp than someone with AoB who dies repeatedly and loses no exp.

 

[Cat]

I agree, could involve skill level too
like...

(dmg pts/1000) x (skill lvl/8) + orig exp =

Example: A character w/ 30 SA (using pure Neckhunter) on Shahadar Palace with 125k dmg

(125k/1000) x (30/8) + 200 = about 670 exp instead of 200


there wouldn't be a problem with high exp bosses though, here's another example


like the same character on Ms_Cave against Shadahar (10k xp) with 40k dmg points

(40k/1000) x (30/8) + 10000 = 10150 instead of just 10000

 

[Thothie]

Oh, but it'd be so much simpler to just nerf the AoB.

/ducks behind desk

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

I think I can safely say that this thread is not being taken seriously.

 

[Cat]

Oh, but it'd be so much simpler to just nerf the AoB.

/ducks behind desk

If only anyone cared about parry exp.

 

[CrazyMonkeyDude]

will take xp from other skills too. I've had it take xp from swords and other skills when I died.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

Oh, but it'd be so much simpler to just nerf the AoB.

/ducks behind desk

Make AoB only prevent exp loss and make an armor of greed that prevents gold loss. I guess that has nothing to do with this thread though.

But even if you DID nerf AoB an exp system like this might still be fun. Every monster should have a base exp that increases as you damage enemies and resets when you die or use the votemap command. However, you should be able to walk from map to map without losing your increased exp. This would encourage players to traverse the world rather than just vote everywhere but it wouldn't remove the votemap feature in any way.

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

And then we should implement a "Monster Kill".

Get it?

 

[Thothie]

It isn't actually viable as XP distribution is stored on individual monsters, not individual players, and assigned when the monster dies.

Only thing that really could be done, to at least deal with the resentment non-AOB users have of the AOB's, is to cause AOB to reduce the death penalty, rather than eliminate it.

 

[FER]

Probably AoB already has something bad: people rely too much on it, not using other armors at all.

I think when you get to high levels losing xp is way worse than getting low xp.

 

[Thothie]

Always ment to adjust the code to allow a reduction of death penalty, rather than total elimination. The fact that monsters regenerate your maxhp value when they slay you prevents really nasty abuse of the AoB, but doesn't really discourage lazier abuses. I could switch it to reduce the penalty by 75%, and then maybe implement expendable potions that can eliminate it entirely. Alternately, could go back to the original model where monsters regenerated 100% with each kill, but that gets horribly obnoxious with some of the meaner creatures, and is straight out with bosses.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

I think it would be better to just make the game get progressively harder to the point where AoB eventually becomes a handicap. Also make new armors as the game progresses that are more alluring than AoB. I just think it is a better solution to build the rest of this game around our equipment rather than just nerfing them. Alot of people won't like an AoB nerf, including myself, although if it happens I promise not to throw a fit/ragequit msc.

Also, until you get to level 30 in a skill death appears to only take exp away from parry making AoB only useful for preserving your useless gold. (I have 222222 gold right now and the obsessive compulsive freak in me does not want that to change)

Is it possible to take my earlier suggestion and make one armor that prevents exp loss and another armor that prevents gold loss?

 

[Thothie]

Harder, but not impossible. Dun really see the point under the current economy... I mean who's going to take the Armor of Greed over the Armor of Bravery, or what not?

*maybe* If the Amor of Greed increased treasure values as well, but it'd be difficult to script, and I suspect folks would just switch armors before they opened chests in anycase.

 

[Thothie]

Speaking of unpopular nerfs, and this seems as good as place to mention it as any, but one that will happen in the next patch is that, thanks to MiB, the Bag of Holding will work the way it was intended to. This means the pack will eliminate the weight of anything placed into it, rather than the hacky effect of just zapping a random -400 or so pounds globally.

I'll probably counter this "nerf" somewhat by allowing the Bag of Holding to take any item (or at least any item the backpack would). (Also probably drop the word 'lesser' from the name, for all the difference that makes.)

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

Harder, but not impossible. Dun really see the point under the current economy... I mean who's going to take the Armor of Greed over the Armor of Bravery, or what not?

*maybe* If the Amor of Greed increased treasure values as well, but it'd be difficult to script, and I suspect folks would just switch armors before they opened chests in anycase.

Good point. Although, is the economy on the list of things to be improved upon eventually? I certainly hope so, at least some day. It seems like it should be relatively easy to come up with buy-able 'in-betweener' items. And by that I mean a level 30 sword that is as powerful as blood drinker but has no special effects whatsoever, as well as a level 20 sword that is as strong as hoarfrost but again, does nothing. There could be a level 25 sword that is stronger than hoar, weaker than BD, and still has no special abilities. This could be repeated for the other weapon types. Just an idea.

Also, I like your latter idea, although switching armors would be a problem. What about this: The armor of greed sells for 1 gold by default but as you collect more and more gold it increases the selling value of the armor, but with a price. You gradually get slower and slower until you only move at a very slow pace. So the greedier you get the stronger the handicap becomes. Also, as the curse increases you could have some merchants be unwilling to buy the armor because of said curse.

Edit: That nerf of the lesser bag of holding is a good one, in my opinion. However, I think the 'lesser' in the title makes some degree of sense, since the bag will lessen the weight of an item to 0.

 

[Keldorn]

The only reason I wear AoB is because losing 2% in a skill can potentially mean losing up to around 25-30k! exp per death. I still try not to die, and usually when I do it's because I try to die from environmental damage so that monsters don't get hp, so I wouldn't lose exp anyway.

A person that can solo a map without dying already gets something: They'll do the map faster. This is especially true against enemies with large amounts of damage reduction, like bludgeons, since they effectively get a lot more hp per kill than say, a Shahaddar Thunderfist.

As for monsters regenerating fully per death, I bet the reversion would just cause a lot of hostility against lower level players.

...And on another note, AoB is completely useless on players with all non-parry skills under level 30, except for saving gold, and they're usually the ones who go around dying a lot to solo maps. I don't really see the point in doing it anyway though, killing mid-level range monsters is a lot more rewarding than killing high level monsters. Seriously, what gives more exp? Spending 20-30 minutes killing one monster worth 2000 exp or spending 20-30 minutes killing 100-400 exp value enemies? There's just no contest. I mean, it's not like you'll get any good loot anyway if you're soloing with low hp and get low points, and if you're looking for loot you'd do better just joining a random server full of people running a high level map and wait long enough to grab something from the individual chest. (Just joined a server running Nashalrath? They're at the last boss? No problem! Get a few hits in and piss everyone else off by getting the [insertspoilerhere], I've seen it happen a few times now. )

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

Just joined a server running Nashalrath? They're at the last boss? No problem! Get a few hits in and piss everyone else off by getting the [insertspoilerhere], I've seen it happen a few times now.

I've seen even worse. I've seen people join AFTER the boss has been beaten and receive the special item with 0 damage points. In fact, I've seen it happen three times in a row. This may have been fixed in the jan2010b patch though, not sure.

 

[Keldorn]

I've seen even worse. I've seen Jordy join AFTER the boss has been beaten and Jordy the special item with 0 damage points. In fact, I've seen it happen three times in a row. This may have been fixed in the jan2010b patch though, not sure.

No, it hasn't been fixed, I saw it too.

 

[Thothie]

Took a stab at in the current FEB2010 alpha - but it doesn't stop them from getting random epics, just the various semi-unique "bonus" items on the map per chest. Might rig it to stop them from getting any items at all, were I more confident in the GM's ability to restore damage points to dropped players.

Still don't think folks are sitting in their server browsers waiting for you to kill the boss, as you suggest - more likely just joining at a particularly opportune moment by sheer luck.

 

[Keldorn]

I'm not really suggesting that people wait until the boss is dead to join, I'm just saying that it's more rewarding to server hop so that you get to open as many individual chests as possible than it is to solo a map while dying a lot.

(I have been getting "Sorry, this chest is empty" notifications in the event hud when I try to use chests that spawned before I joined since jan2010b though, is that new?)

 

[Thothie]

That should only happen if you joined after the chest spawned, and thus it never made an inventory for ye.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

That should only happen if you joined after the chest spawned, and thus it never made an inventory for ye.

Actually that just happened to furion (who had next to zero damage points) on islesofdread1 but he had been in the server since the beginning. I have also seen people join after the chest spawned and receive dragon axes or envenomed plates.

 

[Thothie]

Hrmm... The only other way it should be possible for that to happen is if more than 10 players were about when it spawned, and it thus ran out of string space for shops. :\

 

[FER]

This happened in many map with less than 10 players and after the chest spawned.

About the bag of holding... what will happend if the weight of the equipment outside the bag goes beyond the max weight limit?

 

[Thothie]

Then you'll have to re-arrange your equipment before you can pick up anything else - probably sticking more stuff inside the bag. Technically it's not a nerf... The bag only eliminates about 400lbs as is, and two sets of armor can easily become more than that... Start tossing your weapons in there as well, and with a 32 item limit per bag...