What happened to the bow?

[TheMasterSword]

It was one of the things I loved most about the game. I was so good at it that no matter how far or near, if it could reach, the first shot was a little head, the second was a little behind and the third and most others consecutively were all on target. I would be shooting boars (of were they small bears...) in the nearest open field map (forget the name) and would hardly ever have to back track. Yes it took a lot of arrows, but it was fun.

After many years I come back and the bow has dramatically changed and not for the better. I understand I am level one right now or two. But the bow hardly goes more than a few meters even after I hold the mouse button for the new bar to load at the bottom of the screen and even raise the angle higher and it hardly goes at all.

Also the targeting feels way off. Like I have to aim with the left cuff of the shirt than the actual bow it self and it is consistent in that aim with in reason. In other words I am not aiming down or over the shaft but using my shirt cuff. Why is that? A model inconsistency or that is what actually happened to the bow?

I am sorry if I come off a bit brash, but I downloaded the mod again, even bought HL1 just to play this (among other mods to be fair, but mostly this one) and I find the bow completely off. I understand before you could hit targets far out, much farther than without a bow, but it was relatively weak (Still is apparently as it takes MANY arrows just to down a rat.) compared to the later game melee weapons, especially swords. It is very disheartening.

 

[Dridmar]

The starting bow is complete shit. Once you get a longbow you'll be fine. Don't bother with the tree bows or orcish bows.

 

[TheMasterSword]

Will you aim over the shaft so to speak or still "off the cuff"?

 

[Kanta]

The shortbow and orcish bow are objectively better than the tree bow. They shoot slightly closer to the center of the screen. The wooden longbow shoots much closer to the center and has the longest range of all the bows. The elven longbow shoots dead center and has a fast firerate, but less range compared to the wooden one. All these bows have a level requirement of 1.

As far as I remember bows were always this garbage.

 

[Fegged]

You get used to it. I recently made a new char and had no problems whatsoever, that is because I'll always remember how shitty they are and how to aim with them. Primarily because I love bows the most. But as my previous posters said, Wooden and Elven Bow are the best bows to go for.

 

[Kanta]

Before the Thornbow, or magical bows that is.

 

[zeus9860]

Given the current location of the thornbow, most people will most likely skip that item and go for a magical bow instead.

I've suggested before new arrow based bows, like a bow similiar to the one elite bandits use, you can charge up to 3 arrows in a single shot, have reduced accuracy but stronger impact for example. Or a single more powerfull shot with no penalty (other than the charge time). There's also this one suggestion i had about siphoning life or mana based on your preference, like right click while carrying this one bow to switch between life leech or mana leech with something in trade for it (life leech consumes mana while mana leech would consumes small portions of hp)

As for the op, whenever you see a wooden longbow or elven longbow, keep it. Archery might look like garbage early on, but it's actually one of the strongest skills that is somewhat fast paced throughout the game. You just gotta have some patience for close combat archery and also need to rely on specific ammo (buy iron arrows, they are okayish and cheap, elemental arrows can be of some help early ingame, despite not being that strong unless they are holy).

You might not like what you are about to hear but non elemental bows and arrows are outdated in this game, there are magical bows that outmatch these non elemental versions and the gap between these 2 types isn't that big either. Even the crossbows are "meh", they hit harder than your average bow but are slow as hell and the aiming isn't that great either untill you get your hands on the steam xbow, which is the current endgame xbow. Heavy crossbow used to be great but was nerfed to garbage levels of usefullness since alot of the enemies you are fighting are constantly regenerating HP or moving. If you like shooting a bolt every 6 seconds or so, then you should try getting one of these slowpokes. It hits hard but it also hits slow.

 

[TheMasterSword]

As far as I remember bows were always this garbage.

I am not sure when you started playing, hell I do not even remember when I did, but it was back before Steam was even a glimmer in Gabe's eye. The bow was always relatively weak and it was one of the weakest weapons in the game, although I think at the time the end game sword trumped all weapons anyway. All I know is back in the day the bow you started with was accurate. Where you pointed and fired is where you hit, accounting for the arch of the arrow of course. I was not exaggerating when I said I could nail a boar (Or a baby bear...) in the far distance in the middle of the field with in three shots and basically walk it in to it's death with more arrows. It was the damage you produced that came with better levels in archery as I recall. Now it just seems broken. Why should any bow be fired off center!? It makes no sense. And I have seen "toy" bows shoot further than this starting bow does.

 

[zeus9860]

Well logically speaking, your aim should be off center when you start "practising" archery. You aren't born a pro when you do things for the first time, i can see why they did this with the weaker bows. Tbh this is something i thought about in the past but never understood either, but since you created this thread, i see the reason why it was made. Now if it was made in the best way possible? Probably not.

I think it would have made more sense for the first 10 or 15 levels to slowly adjust your aiming to the center. Or perhaps as you increase your levels, the chances of firing off center are decreased, since you get more and more experience with the skill and there is no such thing as constant perfect aiming. Similiar to a hit chance mechanic, except it would be less painfull as firing off center isn't that big of a deal when there are other factors that can completly ruin your ranged experience in this game, and one of those factors is the ping. If you have a decent ping, you can have some decent fun with projectiles in this game, when you are like close to the 100 mark, it won't be as much fun as it should be.

Bows should all fire equally when it comes to accuracy, the things that should differ from bow to bow is the impact and distance, which also applies to arrow types.

The one thing i don't understand in this game when it comes to archery is the undead stone archers, these things are capable of shooting arrows in a straight line, defying any gravity laws. Should also mention that they can shoot these arrows in your face and instead of pushing you back (knockback), they push you forward.

 

[TheMasterSword]

The arrow placement may be off center, but by god you are still going to aim down the center of the bow/arrow shaft. Even Deus Ex allowed for better accuracy later on, but you still aimed with the cross hairs in the center. You did not aim far left. Right now I am accurately hitting things with in reason, by using the cuff of my sleeve. Again that should not be how you aim with any bow, starter or not. Maybe it is an error on the model or weapon or my game I am not sure, but please do not tell me this is how it is going to be the whole game, aiming off the cuff of my sleeve instead of the bow/arrow shaft.

 

[Kanta]

I literally already explained that the elven longbow and thornbow hit dead center. The wooden longbow is in second place in regards to how close to the center of the screen it shoots.

 

[TheMasterSword]

That does not address the present issue. And that does nothing for anyone until they get those bows. Are we purposely trying to put people off the game?

 

[Kanta]

No. The game is just poorly designed and buggy.

 

[Thothie]

^ Yeah that.

The starter bows haven't been modified in over 10 years, so I dunno when you started playing. We did universally increase the range on all the bows in the alpha, but not on the version you're playing on. The orc and tree bow have always been extremely wonky - going all the way back to the WON version.

The longbow is the first useful bow you come across, and it's in the first boss chest, so you pretty much have it by the end of "tutorial stage".

 

[TheMasterSword]

I got HL1 back when I was in the military so that was very early 2000ish. I am pretty sure I had played Master Sword back then as well, although not sure the name consisted of "Continued", but I can not narrow it any more than that. There have been times I simply did not have internet at home or even a home. So me playing may have been what ever the last version I had and I had no worries of servers not matching, because again I was playing off line by myself. But I know when I was in the military I always had the internet (At least when I was in the barracks. so what was the version back in those days?

Edit: And I can not ever remember upgrading past the starter bow. If I ever had it was either a drop or the next cheapest bow in line. I really hardly ever bought anything. Back when I played just switching hands or even trying to put things into packs like skins/furs with your hands full, as I recall, was a real pain in the back side. So I pretty much just said screw it and explored with mostly starter gear.

 

[Thothie]

Well, anything before 2003 (WON MS1.3) is before my time here, and anything before 2005 is not my fault. Been the same crappy starter bow for longer than half the user base has been alive - didn't touch it myself.

Dun think there's ever been a good one for purchase either (at least, not in Edana) - gotta go kill big spiders. I suppose Thornlands has changed a little bit over the years, but that chest is almost the same as it's ever been as well.

 

[TheMasterSword]

Well, anything before 2003 (WON MS1.3) is before my time here, and anything before 2005 is not my fault. Been the same crappy starter bow for longer than half the user base has been alive - didn't touch it myself.

Dun think there's ever been a good one for purchase either (at least, not in Edana) - gotta go kill big spiders. I suppose Thornlands has changed a little bit over the years, but that chest is almost the same as it's ever been as well.

I remember a darkish cave with cob webs... purple spiders?