ms_bail

[Recidivist]

Been wanting to make a map for MSC for a while, just been to lazy recently. Well, i finaly decided to start.
So far:Lights, basic out line and player spawns done

Being just an island this will not be a huge map but will require teamwork and time to get to the boss. Im thinking of lvl 35 maybe, 600+hp or so, and some new rares if possible. Maybe one transistion to another map i may make of before you start on your voyage. This is my first map for MSC and im not all too good to begin with so it will take time, and my attention span is very small XD

Outline:
A large storm sank your ship and stranded you on a dark stormy island. Crawling with large beasts and unwelcoming tribesmen you are forced to continue through the darkness to defeat the evil Lord Nekaun. Lord Nekaun is rumoured to have treasures dating from thousends of years before, these are the treasures of legends, consisting of such potent migical ability to wreak havoc upon whoever the wielder sees fit. Will you overpower Lord Nekaun, or will you sucumb to the terror of ms_bail.....


Gonna hopefully get some screenshots soon.

Any comments are welcome,

Thanks.

 

[brian4]

New maps are always welcome!

My suggestions
___________________
Free roam
Boss room without an infinite ammount of minions
A large boss room with a way out - or maybe no boss room at all
An original concept - something other than the same old kill all the monsters than kill the boss
Using a regular chest instead of an artifact chest
An interactive and original environment - low gravity or underwater maybe?
No horrors or any monsters that require drunk/blind fights

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

New maps are always welcome!

My suggestions
___________________
Free roam
Boss room without an infinite ammount of minions
A large boss room with a way out - or maybe no boss room at all
An original concept - something other than the same old kill all the monsters than kill the boss
Using a regular chest instead of an artifact chest
An interactive and original environment - low gravity or underwater maybe?
No horrors or any monsters that require drunk/blind fights

I agree on all of those except the artifact chest thingy.

 

[Recidivist]

I intented most of those anyway. There is no boss room, he is underwater in a large cavern with a permenately open entrance/exit. It is pretty much free roam, 3 sections, from the boat there will be the lowest leveld stuff that will attack you while swimming to the island, once you reach the land you will be "greeted" by the tribes, and before and through out the rest of the map is "mini-bosses" (example kodiacs). The boss is accesble with out doing any quest, but will be damn nigh impossible to run too, as i plan to have fast moving creatures roaming around. There will eb NO minions in the boss room. At all. But the entrance will be swarmed with "mini-bosses" called Nekauns Guardians. Once you enter the boss room there will be an invisible room while Nekaun lol's at you and sais GTFO, then it will disapear if you dont GTFO, i plan for ihm to be really fast, attack fast, but hit lower than normal bosses, maybe stun too. I hate Horros and lightning myself so there will not be nay of them at all.

 

[Recidivist]

First screenie, of what i have done, and intend to do.

NOTE: NONE of the textures will be the same. Apart from maybe the floor...

This is mostly just the outline, and proof that i am doing something, slow....but i am doing it

After reading the tutoial, i still find myself stuck on how to create spawns and stuff, but, its2am and im way to tired to take naything in right now.




----- Edit: I forgot to say, you will spawn just under the Lord Nekaun This Way and my mouse, from there you will have to go through the cr*ppy maze in the dark.-----




Well, i hope you like it so far.

Please comment and tell me what'cha think,


Thanks,


Recidivist.


KEY: Pink = chest, Blue = Monster spawns, Green = Mini-boss, Red = Breakable wall, Grey/Brown = Wall.

 

[evilsquirrel]

looking at that screenie....you should probably contact an established mapper for some help...myself, crow, frodo...

because i already see problems in the map from just that screenshot

 

[PBarnum]

you should probably contact an established mapper for some help...myself, crow, frodo...

Ouch...

 

[evilsquirrel]

you should probably contact an established mapper for some help...myself, crow, frodo...

Ouch...

but...i srs >_> he could do with some help...

 

[Mikkel]

You could contact P|Barnum too

 

[Recidivist]

If you could PM me with the problems you see so i could adress them and seek help if i do not not how, that would be great. Although, this is not the map, this is just a plan of it, using only a few *maybe* correct textures, and not cut/placed to the standard i plan to make it for the final version. Having the help of a mapper such as P or crow or anyone who has mapped for MSC would be great, as i am not a particularly good mapper for anyway, i just find it fun, with their help maybe i could actualy produce a good map. Maybe a few .

 

[Boom]

The concept sounds like lots of fun, help from an experienced mapper would probably make this map excellent. Good job so far Recid - Keep it up!

 

[subenji99]

I'm not even a mapper and I see what evilsquirrel is getting at - you have overlapping brushes.

Just look at the outside walls - you should resize and vertex manipulate those walls together. Remember to use the grid snap to avoid leaks.
Oh also, your skybox shouldn't be an actual box that surrounds your map. A tutorial would help to explain how to use the skybox texture better - i'll try to dig one up.

Edit: this was written for Half-Life 2 but the skybox usage applies to both games.
http://www.student.ru.nl/rvanhoorn/opti ... er=notices

 

[PBarnum]

Remember to use the grid snap to avoid leaks.

Please don't follow this.

 

[subenji99]

I demand an explanation!

Seroiusly, in every tutorial, guide, and tip from mappers I've ever seen, "use grid snap" has been a golden rule - even on developer.valvesoftware.com:

Taking your time when building, and making sure brushes are snapped properly to the grid can go a long way towards eliminating leaks before they occur. The cleaner and more organized you build your geometry, the more likely you are to be able to spot leaks when they occur, or even prevent them from happening in the first place.

 

[Jelly]

It's even in the ten commandments of HL mapping.


Ye 10 Commandments of HL1 Mapping

-Thou shall not hollow anything, ever
-Thou shall not carve anything, ever
-Thou shall not use cylinders without aligning every vertex to the grid
-Thou shall not scale spikes, and thou shall make sure each vertex of a spike aligns to the grid
-Thou shall not overlap brushes
-Thou shall not scale or rotate complex nor oddly shaped objects nor rooms nor hallways
-Thou shall not build a box around your map to avoid leaks (nor for any other reason)
-Thou shalt always snap to grid
-Thou shalt always align to a large grid (x16+) when not drawing details
-Thou shalt follow the omni-present law of KISS

 

[Recidivist]

I doesnt have a skybox at all, so there is nothing surrounding it.
As i said before, this isnt the map, this is just a plan. Please remember that. This is just so oyu can see the layout of it, and so i have some reference to what the f*ck im doing. That version of the map will NEVER: be compiled, run,get out of the black void of being removed from recycle bin.

Enough of the problems with it Comment on the concept and look of it, NOT PROBLEMS

Next screenie coming soon. Another hammer pic, just to show i am still working on it, and that i dont give a f*ck about the problems your saying it has BECAUSE ITS A PLAN

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

i dont give a f*ck about the problems your saying it has BECAUSE ITS A PLAN

I know a guy who talked like that before in a "My new map" topic in these very forums once, and from that post onward everybody was just like "Yeah whatever noob" & "Your map sucks" so I suggest you relax a bit

As for P|Barnum not recommending snap-to-grid: :| :| :| :| :|

 

[Recidivist]

Hey i am relaxed JM Just wanting to get over meh point that its a plan I do care about the crit people are giving, but i have sed its a plan and the actual map will not have these problem ( I HOPE!). Well, if thar are any mapper out there with some spare time and willing to help me with this it'd be much appreciated.

 

[Thothie]

As for P|Barnum not recommending snap-to-grid: :| :| :| :| :|

I'm sure that's not what he meant. Snap-to-grid is the end-all-be-all of the Half-Life Mapping Bible's Ten Commandments. Which I will post again, since the tutorial is too long for anyone to read and thus they are often overlooked:


Ye 10 Commandments of HL1 Mapping

-Thou shall not hollow anything, ever
-Thou shall not carve anything, ever
-Thou shall not use cylinders without aligning every vertex to the grid
-Thou shall not scale spikes, and thou shall make sure each vertex of a spike aligns to the grid
-Thou shall not overlap brushes
-Thou shall not scale or rotate complex nor oddly shaped objects nor rooms nor hallways
-Thou shall not build a box around your map to avoid leaks (nor for any other reason)
-Thou shalt always snap to grid
-Thou shalt always align to a large grid (x16+) when not drawing details
-Thou shalt follow the omni-present law of KISS

There are a few, rare circumstances in which you can leave the grid, but anything thus created had damned well be an entity brush, and you don't want too many of those.

 

[evilsquirrel]

.......why even make a plan like that?

much easier to just sketch it on graph paper or summat...

 

[PBarnum]

I never snap to grid. It's not my thing.

 

[subenji99]

I attempted to come up with a joke comparing mapping without using grid snap to Amish home plumbing, but it's too late to think straight

Rec, you should have mentioned that you only did incredibly rough brushwork for the concept picture's benefit. You've had us all critisizing your work before you've begun it!
On the map design, it seems as though you've only shown us about 1/4 to 1/3rd of the map so far, like it would be lostcastle's castle lobby and the maze with gold forged skeleton mini-boss only, then loot. Nevertheless, I'll comment on what there is:
Open spaces are often overlooked unless something happens in them. You have a random dropping of monsters sprawled across it - it looks like a design for a free-roam map. Nevertheless, it fits the story you gave to your map well.

Mazes are another part of maps that go unappreciated. Once one person figures the route out, every player will follow that route and know the maze's solution. That is, unless you do a maze such as on cleicert, which is quite difficult to follow another player through, or have a dynamic maze with moving walls.

I don't know what enemies you are considering for a mini-boss, but I can't see any problems with the setup to it.

Some overall comments:
Mazes are a little cliche. They've been done lots of times, and you need something unique to make your maze stand out.

You are going to need ways to slow down players that attempt to rush the map - although you say you are aiming for a map that requires teamwork and a time investment to beat, so it shouldn't be a problem.

Add puzzles, especially if you can make them require different solutions every map load, and even better if you need more than 1 player to accomplish them easily. However, it's probably best not to make it so that it's actually impossible for only 1 player to complete, only difficult and time-consuming for 1 player. (e.g. garon on calruin2 - it's possible to solo him, but it's very difficult to get him where you need him.)

Remember that for level 35's, a dark maze won't be dark at all - as everyone will have a high level glow spell.

Feel free to take and ignore whatever you want from all this.

 

[Recidivist]

Thanks benji, i will be keeping that all in mind. I forgot to take screenies, and i really cba to do it now, had a real annoying time with hammer. Decided to add and underground with the kind of Fire Giants from wicardoven as a kind of hell-ish place. Also done Lord Nekauns Chamber, submerged in the sea. I as hoping to do a kind of Water Giant kind of thing, which would mean a blue reskin of a Undead Fire Giant. Would it be possilbe to give them a spell like Runeghar (Or w/e) from Loda-1. Like the Tornado, but in water, a whirlpool kinda thing that like lifts you uo and throw you back, maybe does a little damage. I not quite sure, there are so many ideas going through my head that its hard to explain them all.
Anyway, jsut keeping you posted that a little more has been done to the plan, and i have started bringing some of it into the final version, mostly just sea and the floor but....its something