The new patch causes lag

[J-M v2.5.5]

As the topic title says, the new patch causes lag. Both of my servers, BoU #1 and BoU #2, experience some serious lag. I played mscave today (and it lagged pretty hard) and after that I went to ms_snow with four other dudes, and the lag was so bad I just had to leave.

I haven't altered my server setups, and I'm not downloading anything, so the circumstances under which my servers operate are exactly the same. Thothie, you probably added lots of cool stuff (which I can't check out because of the lag), but somewhere you must have messed up big time. I don't remember any of the previous patches causing this much lag.

And I'm not just talking about lag, I'm talking about waiting-for-a-radio-signal-to-come-from-Pluto-lag. I'm talking about massive lag. Huge lag, lag that is too big to even describe. I could rant on for paragraphs about this lag. It's really that bad.

 

[BioRage]

As the topic title says, the new patch causes lag. Both of my servers, BoU #1 and BoU #2, experience some serious lag. I played mscave today (and it lagged pretty hard) and after that I went to ms_snow with four other dudes, and the lag was so bad I just had to leave.

I haven't altered my server setups, and I'm not downloading anything, so the circumstances under which my servers operate are exactly the same. Thothie, you probably added lots of cool stuff (which I can't check out because of the lag), but somewhere you must have messed up big time. I don't remember any of the previous patches causing this much lag.

And I'm not just talking about lag, I'm talking about waiting-for-a-radio-signal-to-come-from-Pluto-lag. I'm talking about massive lag. Huge lag, lag that is too big to even describe. I could rant on for paragraphs about this lag. It's really that bad.

Might be something with your internet connection im on 1.3 MB connection and I hosting 6-7 is free of lag (30 - 80 ping) Otherwise if there are from other places (Wotan -> Germany then there ping is sky high)

Also what could cause the lag is:
A) The map
-> Mobs etc
-> Magic
B) The players

 

[Belmont]

I have the same problem, but I always lagged, no matter what, with two people pings alredy go 300+ :X

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

the circumstances under which my servers operate are exactly the same.

 

[evilsquirrel]

yes, i too have noticed a bit of lag increase...but it seems fine for about the first hour of a map - perhaps theres some reason that it builds up continually?

 

[RED]

I have noticed people complaining on my server about lag. My server used to run great, and it's the same set up as before.

 

[BioRage]

Well I guess I can say as well, I was running 7 people on goblintown, it was packed, 0 lag at all, mabye 1 - 2 spikes, we go to helena 2000 +...

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

I'm glad the problem is being recognized. And by that I don't mean I'm glad your servers are lagging

It would just suck if I were the only one with this problem, because I wouldn't know how to fix it (I didn't change anything that would mess up the servers).

 

[Jelly]

As far as I know it's the orcs that is causing the lag. I dunno how nor why but it's the orcs. The other monsters seems to work without lagging.

 

[Thothie]

Hmmm... It maybe the base orc AI. It only seems ot happen where orcs are spread out though. (ie. no effect on Orcplace2_beta)

Goblintown, Daragoth, and MScave would all be heavily affected. (note: goblins also use Orc AI)

I can't think of a way to optimize the AI any further, without going back to the potentially brain dead variety that ignore their friend's cries for help and don't navigate nearly so well...

So, choices seem to be:
1) Go back to BD AI.
2) Optimize those maps so they don't spawn orcs all over the place (ie. no where near the players)

#2 I intend to do eventually in either case...

Just for the fun of it, I'll give ye all the source for the new AI, together with the scripting instructions. If anyone has any ideas for further optimization, feel free:
http://www.thothie.com/msc/ai3.0.rar

Note that: In these scripts, base_npc_attack_new is the AI, and it is an include in base_monster_new which also includes base_npc - the latter two I didn't put in the package as they have game info, and no events that trigger in cycles (ie. nothing that may cause lag).

I *might* be able to tweak the old AI to have some of the features of the new AI with no new cycles, but not all.

Get your votes in before October 1st, as that's the due date for the next patch. (Should be 1st of ea. month from here on out)

 

[BioRage]

Noooooo

WE CANT GO BACK TO STUPID AI's!!!

They are the 1337's.... really... they are, just set the sever to high priorty and it should be good, but I pefer smarter Ai's... makes teh game challenging, and intresting

 

[evilsquirrel]

I'll have to go with option 2, using option 1 as a temporary fix for those who can't stand the lag.

I, however, will not be going back to the braindead AI...lag doesn't bother me much...and its fixed by just restarting the map...deal with it people...

 

[Thothie]

Bio - could you put a carriage return or something in your "NOooooooooooo!" line, so it don't stretch out the forums and make them illegible.

I'd do it for ya, but I apparently have no auth in this section for some reason...

Anyways, thats 2 vote for map edits.

Downside of map edits is that I have to add them to the patch,
lest I do them via ripent, which is a lot harder for this sort of thing.

 

[evilsquirrel]

people dont mind large patch downloads thothie - just look at empires with its patch thats somewhere around 180mb!

and if its bandwidth you're worried about, the patches will be on moddb now too soo.... >_>

 

[Thothie]

You don't have to download the Empires patch every month. :\

Two more maps shouldn't add *that* much to it though, if I could take the time to do it via ripent, only the servers would need to upgrade - but I think it'd take too much time out of my attempts to get the hard code going.

 

[evilsquirrel]

no thothie - a while ago, you had to download the new empires patch every week

now its about every 2 months-ish

 

[Thothie]

Jeeze...

...although it's also true we don't have some sort of interface that auto-updates for you when you start the game.

 

[evilsquirrel]

that would be coool...

but nor does empires o_o

its a half-life 2 Mod, something like a 680mb download with a 180mb patch every 2-ish months

 

[Thothie]

Okay, my guilt for taking th 4MB patch to 7MB is subsiding somewhat...

Suspect those maps will make the next one 10MB though.

 

[BioRage]

Bio - could you put a carriage return or something in your "NOooooooooooo!" line, so it don't stretch out the forums and make them illegible.

I'd do it for ya, but I apparently have no auth in this section for some reason...

Anyways, thats 2 vote for map edits.

Downside of map edits is that I have to add them to the patch,
lest I do them via ripent, which is a lot harder for this sort of thing.

fixed

 

[BioRage]

mabye patches every week would be better just like how you should disk clean up etc.!... IW ouldnt mind it, even if they arent HUGE , minor fixes is better then none....

Im still looking for my frekaing shield!

 

[Thothie]

Trying to move away from that (I mean, we had a few patches within 3 days of one another in June). If we had an auto-update system, I'd consider it. There used to be a system for it in WON (though it required a plugin) - but it no longer exists in Steam so far as I can see.

Better to have predictable updates... That way maybe Hellzdiner can keep up. The map makers get beta-leaks though, so they can test the new stuff before the public gets slapped too hard totally untested crap. In addition my beta-test server runs a slightly newer copy than the public update from time to time (so long as there are no new items that prevent it.)

 

[BioRage]

Trying to move away from that (I mean, we had a few patches within 3 days of one another in June). If we had an auto-update system, I'd consider it. There used to be a system for it in WON (though it required a plugin) - but it no longer exists in Steam so far as I can see.

Better to have predictable updates... That way maybe Hellzdiner can keep up. The map makers get beta-leaks though, so they can test the new stuff before the public gets slapped too hard totally untested crap. In addition my beta-test server runs a slightly newer copy than the public update from time to time (so long as there are no new items that prevent it.)

hmm k.. and lol to hellz diner... x.x............................ Curse that sever o.o, besides the fact its 24/7 xD!

 

[Thothie]

I made two little tweaks to the New AI, on my server... And I had six people playing Daragoth today, with not more lag than usual on Daragoth (it's hard to tell though, because Daragoth always lags like mad).

The the tweaks I made though are so minor seems couldn't make that much difference, so I dunno.

I moved the

setvard HUNT_LASTTARGET NPCATK_TARGET

Inside the first if ( NPCATK_TARGET isnot unset ) {} bracket, so they aren't setting that compatability cvar while idle. And I added a seperator:

if CYCLE_TIME != CYCLE_TIME_IDLE

Just before that same conditional, to ensure they would not run any hunt cycle / setmovedests below that line until they've spotted something worth killing. (or are alerted by an ally that there maybe something worth killing)

Maps still need optimizing though - even under the old AI, they use a lot more CPU than they need to. (Daragoth especially)

I'm (right now) adding a conditional that only Guard types will alert their allies about NPC's that attack them. I figure all other monsters only need to chain-react to players.