It's time to move on...

[hauptmann]

MSC is a great game, and has a magical attraction to it that many modern games can't replicate.
However, it's engine and the general layout of the game are extremely outdated. All the new content is nice and it's easy to see how much effort has been put into it.

That being said, it's time to move on.
If the same initiative and amount of effort when into making MSS, it would be released that much sooner.
I feel that while MSC was a benchmark for the HL Engine, I think your effort could be spent on making a benchmark game for the Source Engine before it's outdated. (Waiting any longer to make help complete MSS just seems silly.)

 

[FER]

Before source gets outdated?

Are you so paranoid for engines? even if Source gets outdate it will still be much better engine to work than HL1

 

[The Man In Black]

I was under the impression that I was working on this because I enjoyed it >_>

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

I disagree with the notion that abandoning a decades worth of work is a good idea.

 

[Dridmar]

Yeah, I've stuck with MSC so long because I enjoy the game and making maps for it. I also prefer GoldSource over Source, simplistic yet fun.

Go back to Runescape, hauptmann.

 

[jon50559]

Source is outdated. Even the amount of work you need to put into everything to make it look presentable is more than other modern engines. The toolsets are dated, open up hammer for Source, open up hammer for GoldSrc, they're nearly identical.

In short the engine you work with is preference, as you can tell I don't prefer Source to this engine, and that's why many other people are here as well.

 

[zeus9860]

The hell with source modding, i still haven't got in the mood to accept source so easily into my world. I prefer sticking to the old stylish game we have Maybe, *once* Ms:S gets a release i'll try it out, but without a central server it wont last long... for me at least. :roll:

 

[hauptmann]

I was under the impression that I was working on this because I enjoyed it >_>

So you wouldn't have fun making things for Source?

I disagree with the notion that abandoning a decades worth of work is a good idea.

So lets continue the following projects:

World War 2
Using Cassette Players
The Civil War
Using Windows 98
The Crusades
Using Chariots instead of cars

Working on MSS would be like continuing the MS Legacy, rather than abandoning decades of work.
In other words, it would be like breathing fresh air into the MS setting.

Go back to Runescape, hauptmann.

I must suggest that you go back to Middle School where comments like that are considered clever or funny.

Source is outdated. Even the amount of work you need to put into everything to make it look presentable is more than other modern engines. The toolsets are dated, open up hammer for Source, open up hammer for GoldSrc, they're nearly identical.

In short the engine you work with is preference, as you can tell I don't prefer Source to this engine, and that's why many other people are here as well.

As mentioned in the first post, it's not only the HL engine that's outdated, It's the game as a whole. I feel that people who show as much talent as the MSC contributors could work miracles for MSS.

Maybe, *once* Ms:S gets a release i'll try it out, but without a central server it wont last long... for me at least.

I'm sure any contribution would be appreciated by the developers of MSS.

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

...

 

[zeus9860]

GIF!

Mega lol!



Anyways, this is that kind of case that someone says "Stop thinking about the past and start thinking about the future", i'm also that kind of person but in this case i don't see a reason to do so. Let's say that most recent game engines don't touch everyone's enjoyment like the old ones which we are used to. If we like the mod for goldensource engine, can't say we should move/quit/forget ms:c and hop into the ms:s side.

It's just like perfering old quake games over the most recent quake titles, which i do believe that suck balls.

 

[Orochi]

By the way, the MSC team IS helping out the MSS Team. We're currently stationed here, in the Developer section of these forums, which have been graciously shared by the MSC Team. It's more work than you think to get a game going, especially one with as many setbacks as MSS has had. The MSC Team helps where they can, so please don't assume that nothing is being done on MSS.

 

[The Man In Black]

My efforts for MS:C are because I enjoy working on it and it's what I'm good at. Moving onto Source would not be fun. If you want to move on to Source, by all means.

 

[Freerad]

GIF!

Lol

I agree that moving to source would not be fun, but as said so will I...if you want to move on go ahead.

 

[PBarnum]

I was under the impression that I was working on this because I enjoyed it >_>

That is very true, and I am very much the same way. EVen though I don't work on content as much anymore... I dev more than I play.

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

So lets continue the following projects:

World War 2
Using Cassette Players
The Civil War
Using Windows 98
The Crusades
Using Chariots instead of cars

I think the primary difference here is that most of those endeavors are actually finished already. Unlike MSC, which is still a work in progress.

 

[Thothie]

I was kinda with ya, Hauptmann, until your second post demonstrated you were utterly insane. ( Shades of McCain 2000 vs. McCain 2008. >< )

Main reason I work, primarily, on the HL1 version of this game, is there's a decade worth of work put into it, that the Source version can't hope to catch up to in anything less than half that time. ...and I kinda want to see this project to its fruition (which, if not for my earlier nearly two-year hiatus, I think we would be just about at now, and which also not-so-kindly demonstrated what the future of this project would be without me working on it - ie. none whatsoever). Additionally, MSS doesn't have strong enough a team ATM (IMO), and without this game's continued existence and expansion, it's hard to raise interest in and gather new members for the MSS project.

I've no preference for the HL1SDK over Source. I've more experience with HL1, but that's simply a result of HL1 having been around longer. I've worked with a few Source mods, and while the SDK is frustrating as hell by comparison, the visual rewards are a lot greater... Not that I put much weight behind visual rewards... But some mods require a level of immersion that the HL1 engine just can't offer (not Mastersword, mind ye, but some).

However, truth be told, eventually, Mastersword is going to be left with no choice but to go to Source, because, eventually, either Valve or Microsoft is going to kill this game. As a publicly held company, Microsoft is required to pursue profit by law, and if they can get enough money from media companies, fearing for their copyrighted material, by putting an end to OpenGL, they will be required to do so, by law. Valve is still privately held, but if they go public (and there's rumors that they may yet do so), they'll have to re-evaluate their entire support for mods and the HL1 engine. If a shareholder challenges the profitability of that, they'll have to defend it in court, and it'd be a hard sell. Even if Valve doesn't go public, or revaluate that themselves, they still have an entire division dedicated to constantly tinkering with the HL1 engine and HLDS, and every time they tinker with either, there's a chance they may do something that will break MSC beyond repair. (Just as said tinkering has broken so many other mods.)

Granted, under the Source engine, you are kinda in the same boat, as far as the Valve end of things are concerned (only real way out of that is to license your own engine or go with an open source one). However, you are at least covered on the Microsoft half, and given Valve's tenacity of adapting to new versions of windows fairly quickly, that's certainly the more worrisome half.

Eventually, yes, we will need to migrate from Source too (Source being, as some have pointed out, fairly dated itself already). I dunno if we can hope to get passed around on as many engines as say, Team Fortress has (Quake1->HL1->Quake2->Unreal2k4->Quake3->Source), but the advantage of being a mod over stand-alone, I suppose, is you do get forced to upgrade your engine every now and again, and it's true, we've been putting it off for an awfully long time.

So lets continue the following projects:

World War 2
Using Cassette Players
The Civil War
Using Windows 98
The Crusades
Using Chariots instead of cars

I think the primary difference here is that most of those endeavors are actually finished already. Unlike MSC, which is still a work in progress.

I rate this argument about a 9.5 on the logical fallacy scale, but just for the hell of it... There are video games for about half of those, so I guess we are continuing those projects for fun as well. Plus all the Civil War reenactment clubs, which I suppose a Hauptmann minded person would go over to and demand they use automatic weapons in order to "get with the times" (and probably get a similar response).

(And about half the skyscrapers in LA would have burned to the ground by now if not for laptops that can still use Windows 98, but that's another story, and certainly not by choice. >_>)

 

[FER]

Personally I would love to move to an opensource engine, just so people wont need one game to play another.

 

[jon50559]

For luls we could port MSC via HL:Source style, and while it'd look crappy as hell for Source standards, it'd be functional

 

[Orochi]

Lawl, not really. FYI, I'd have to go through EVERY one of the models in MSC and recompile them with vertex weighting and physics meshes, plus converting all textures into materials. No thanks.

 

[Thothie]

Textures you can do by batch files... And models are easy - just paste generics into the QC. Thing is, the end result would actually look even worse than HL1 (or even HL Source), and you've really axed half your reason to change engines if you're going to look worse rather than better.

I'd almost do it, if the plan was to replace models and maps as time went on... But the *REALLY* hard part would be transfering the code into the Source SDK, especially this code, it being such a mess.

 

[hauptmann]

Part of my desire for a source switch is the lack of intermediate content is MSC.
I can't experience the newest and hardest maps in MSC because I get smote down in five seconds. I don't have enough health because I'm a hardcore specialist pro and since there isn't an easy way to level with out playing *CENSORED* over and over again, I'm left looking for fun in lower level maps. And even though I'm level 34 I only have 399hp because, again, I'm a hardcore specialist pro. So after I get bored of trying to grind for levels I look at MSS and see a fresh new way to experience the game I know and love. So if you guys think moving to MSS isn't a good idea then at least throw an intermediate map my way, (with decent XP!!!!).

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

1) There are indeed way too few intermediate maps.
2) This game isn't made for specialists.
3) Sharing good locations to level in the forums is always a bad idea.

 

[FER]

Balance of a game doesnt depend on the engine...

 

[TheOysterHippopotami]

Hopefully there will be a class system some day.

 

[hauptmann]

Balance of a game doesnt depend on the engine...

Didn't say it did. I said its the main reason I would like a source switch.