Possible Delay

[Shurik3n]

Enjoy having a map that will only be played once.

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

J-M's guide to permanently fuck up a map that could have actually been fun:

1) Make a bossroom you can't escape from.
2) Make sure you have a boss that constantly freezes you (optional: ask Thothie to give the boss wallhacking abilities - see brown bear god).
3) Make sure there are infinitely respawning boss minions.
4) Make sure that some of these minions (preferrably twenty) are ranged and unreachable.
5) Make sure that the boss room is either:
A - Riddled with holes, resulting in a large amount of time to return to the bossroom
B - Riddled with teleporters that bring you back to... the bossroom, so there's no way at all to run from the boss.
6) Make sure that some of the minions (at least five) constantly knock you around. Holes work very good for this method of screwing up a map.
7) Create about fifty waves of monsters before you reach the bossroom, and make sure that every wave is amazingly boring, slow and long.
8) Make sure that players have to walk abnormal distances to reach further areas of the map. This adds to the "longetivity" of your map.

Don't ****ing ever put any of the above in your map or I will come to your house and kill you.

 

[Shurik3n]

Ah J-M, what about monsters that spew poison lightning that disorients you for 23 minutes?

Hopefully a flying variant you can't touch, but will continue to disorient as you navigate your way across a one unit wide bridge.

 

[The Man In Black]

6) Make sure that some of the minions (at least five) constantly knock you around. Holes work very well for this method of screwing up a map.

 

[tehrilez]

hay guys the regular bludgeon is hard enough for the average player so lets make a BOSS bludgeon that is probably 3 times stronger and is more powerful/has more hacks/will be able to attack you from spawn more than atholo!!1 this will only make it more fun and challenging!1 stfu if low levels cuz you can be just strong enough to attempt this in several months and then die!1 if you cant play a video game for several months straight then stfu and play edana u nublet!! that goes for all u levle 30s out there if u arent godd enugh for lvl 50 just gtfo out my map and play nightmare thornalnds nub!1


seriously, why dont we take this and WW2 and put it all in one room and put 100dmg trigger hurts on the floor with 3 atholos on ledges with no element stones so they cant die

 

[Thraxis]

Because this isn't MS:S, it's MSC. It's out, it works, it's functioning, and people have the liberty to make just about anything they want that fits in the game. If people want to make hard things, let them make hard things, and you can avoid it like the plauge.

Sorry that it takes 10 hours combined of smart game play (from scratch, with no help from anyone) to reach a few level 20's and be at around 300 hp with decent equipment to actually help even in maps like Lodagond.

It isn't about play time, it's more about how you use that play time.

If you want lower level stuff, go and make lower level stuff. Code/script/map/texture/model/whatever it and present it, get it in game and then please refrain from trying to bash other people from doing what they have an ability to do.

I feel like it's almost necessary to piss these "zomg so hard, you sux because you dedicate time into a game" people off. Learn to be constructive, learn to voice your opinion in a way that doesn't flame people for what they want to do (I know, ironic, but right now I don't care).

I don't care if a boss room has 1000 minions that stun, poison, blind, freeze and defile me. I don't care if there are 10,000 holes in the boss room for me to fall in. Yes, it is annoying but it's better than the days where people made cheat maps where you were invulnerable to monsters, and people just sat there +attack in console and leave their games on (much like parry sitting now, except it actually did something).

Honestly, if you want to sit and cry, then at least sit cry and be productive about it. I don't necessarily like all the music in MSC, so I'm writing music in hopes that a mapper or two will pick it up and use it.

Please, grow up or at least act like you can be mature and solve problems instead of sitting and flaming someone for their artistic vision.

 

[villager]

Thank you, ffs.

 

[Blasto121]

I don't necessarily like all the music in MSC, so I'm writing music in hopes that a mapper or two will pick it up and use it.

music you say? What style of music?

anything ominous?

 

[Thothie]

If I was the type to QFT posts, I would do so for Thraxis.

I do find it amusing how J-M (and now apparently Shurik3n) spend most of their map criticism time complaining about the maps that get the most playtime. (Bloodrose being in the #4 position, and Cleircert being the #2 - I'm guessing that's what the reference to bosses and pits with tossing minions and drunk fighting 3D is about). Some vague reference to the wall hacking bear god when Skycastle is also very popular (which is dodgable by the way, lest you go AFK in the spawn, then yer fair game). It’s also ironic that the people that complain about the most, are people who are more than high enough level to handle the maps in question with relative ease. I get much less complaints from the mid to low-high levelers who actually have to work to finish one of those maps.

At the same time, as I’ve said before, I would like to see more mid-level, more fluid maps. I’d also like to see a lot less b*tching and a lot less cheating, being the two chief things making me want to drop this project at the moment.

 

[PBarnum]

But wouldn't they have the most right to b*tch about maps because they are such high levels?

 

[Thothie]

Because they finish them easier than just about anyone else and say they are too hard, while I get a lot less complaints from those for whom they actually are hard? In some bizarro reverse-logic world, maybe.

 

[Gurluas]

Calm down, the bosses in part 1 wont be much harder than the potion dudes in the_keep

but part 2 will have a strong connection with lore, and thus it will be a real hard boss, you wont fight against some mr-nobody-that-was-a-general-of-malgoriand skeleton, but a really powerful entity of chaos.

 

[tehrilez]

then this map better have a bad ass reward you dont need 9 players to get

 

[WeissberV]

then this map better have a bad ass reward you dont need 9 players to get

haha you'll need 9 + players to beat it lol

 

[Shadeska]

Bout a month ago I ran through cleicert with a fellow lvl 25 named Cat.

We owned
But all we got was a heavy hammer
So ya'll quit yer whinin' bout "pushback" and "boss feedin" and "bottomless pits." Ya'll best stick yer damn heads up yer own bottomless pit!

 

[FER]

Seriously, Lodagond is not as hard as Crow wanted it to be. In some way that map requieres more skill than being high level

 

[The Man In Black]

Bout a month ago I ran through cleicert with a fellow lvl 25 named Cat.

We owned
But all we got was a heavy hammer
So ya'll quit yer whinin' bout "pushback" and "boss feedin" and "bottomless pits." Ya'll best stick yer damn heads up yer own bottomless pit!

I've never called Cleicert hard - just annoying with the constant drunk fights.

 

[Shadeska]

I didn't say "hard" either. I said, "Quit yer whinin'"

 

[Shurik3n]

Because they finish them easier than just about anyone else and say they are too hard

The maps aren't hard, they're annoying. Its a huge difference that map makers need to learn.

 

[CrazyMonkeyDude]

AKA: Mapper thinks to him/herself, "HMMMMMM... This map is too... Streamline. Too easy... Well. Instead of going back through and making changes to make the map harder and better, I'm just gonna stick LOL WALLHAXING ICE BASTARDS and OMFG DRUNK FIGHT TEIM monsters in! That makes it hard! lolamirite?!"

 

[J-M v2.5.5]

Basically what CrazyMonkeyDude just said.

 

[Crow]

....making changes to make the map harder and better...

Ooohh, instead of adding harder monsters, all I really have to do is make changes so my map is harder and better! I've been doing it wrong this whole time! I'm so glad us mappers were born with the ability to just know exactly how to make a map that is both hard and fun to play.

Because it's really just that easy.




Mapping is a learning process, and the ability to create an environment that is both challenging and enjoyable is not some option on our map editor we just keep forgetting to press down. It's not that easy. Yet everywhere I look its "omg this isnt fun, why the hell can't you make it right, what the hell are you doing?"
We don't map just for jollies. We do it for you, the community. With few exceptions, I have yet to see "Hey, your map is cool and all, but maybe try this, or maybe take out that, or maybe add this so this doesnt happen." The average msc mapper has one or two maps under his belt, and when he posts his ideas, all he wants is some input so he can make his map better for you. What the hell can we get out of "we don't want drunk fights, we dont want holes in the floor, we dont want bosses with aoe frozen attacks, we dont want this, we dont want that" Your brain is just as pink and squisy and filled with ideas as ours is, so maybe help us out a little, give us something to work with. I'm sure as much as we wish we could just find a solution to these problems, HL1 doesnt give us much to work with, and coming up with different ways to make gameplay more ineresting than just "go up to this monster, press attack, run away and heal, rinse and repeat till dead" is no easy feat.

Bitch and moan all day, but some day you'll find you have no one left to bitch at.

 

[WeissberV]

....making changes to make the map harder and better...

Ooohh, instead of adding harder monsters, all I really have to do is make changes so my map is harder and better! I've been doing it wrong this whole time! I'm so glad us mappers were born with the ability to just know exactly how to make a map that is both hard and fun to play.

Because it's really just that easy.




Mapping is a learning process, and the ability to create an environment that is both challenging and enjoyable is not some option on our map editor we just keep forgetting to press down. It's not that easy. Yet everywhere I look its "omg this isnt fun, why the hell can't you make it right, what the hell are you doing?"
We don't map just for jollies. We do it for you, the community. With few exceptions, I have yet to see "Hey, your map is cool and all, but maybe try this, or maybe take out that, or maybe add this so this doesnt happen." The average msc mapper has one or two maps under his belt, and when he posts his ideas, all he wants is some input so he can make his map better for you. What the hell can we get out of "we don't want drunk fights, we dont want holes in the floor, we dont want bosses with aoe frozen attacks, we dont want this, we dont want that" Your brain is just as pink and squisy and filled with ideas as ours is, so maybe help us out a little, give us something to work with. I'm sure as much as we wish we could just find a solution to these problems, HL1 doesnt give us much to work with, and coming up with different ways to make gameplay more ineresting than just "go up to this monster, press attack, run away and heal, rinse and repeat till dead" is no easy feat.

**** and moan all day, but some day you'll find you have no one left to **** at.

Bravo! U still hax at mapping though lol

 

[CrazyMonkeyDude]

Are you saying you suck at mapping, or that people who can't map shouldn't be making high level maps where they have to fall back upon those annoying tactics to make a map longer?

Though if you want ideas on ways to make a map better, I'll try to think of some.

 

[Crow]

Both of those or pretty far from what I was actually trying to get across. If you missed it by that much, I dunno what to tell ya

Unfortuneatly, the non mapper can only contribute so much, as having no knowladge of how mapping works hinders the ability to give good constructive criticism and to come up with new ideas specifially for mapping. This is understandable, but yes, at least try ^_^